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TOPIC: Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3

Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 08 Jun 2016 19:03 #77613

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"Given this event is organised to fit in with the plans of the ProApps team..." Is it really? I'm not sure anyone really knows this or not. I'd be interested how we know it is coordinated with the Pro Apps dev teams. Apple isn't putting this on, FMC is, and I'm not sure Apple tells them anything the rest of us don't know. I'm just very curious about that comment.

Will we see a Sept update? No one has a clue.

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 08 Jun 2016 19:28 #77616

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On a side note, with "Subscriptions" coming to the App Store, will Adobe start selling its products there, and/or will Apple start charging subscriptions for the pro apps? I highly doubt Apple makes the pro apps subscription based. They make a ton of money off them already. Why create more hassle for your end users?

Here's the details Apple has published already.
developer.apple.com/app-store/subscriptions/whats-new/

And yes, it effects all OS versions. "How it Works; All current subscriptions on iOS, tvOS, and OS X are eligible."

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Last edit: by BenB.

Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 09 Jun 2016 12:28 #77667

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Wasn't Color Finale going to release their Pro version in May?
I wonder if they are waiting as well on 10.3....

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 09 Jun 2016 12:54 #77671

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The demo at NAB was running on the current FCPX version. I asked him and they're just dealing with techie stuff, beta testing, on current FCPX versions. Sometimes you don't fix bugs as fast as you expected to. Besides, Apple doesn't tell developers about unannounced technology, so there's no way any would know what to wait for.

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Last edit: by BenB.

Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 13 Jun 2016 05:39 #77768

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In about 13 hours Tim will have said "one more thing.." and I really hope it is an update to FCPX, and not a new subscription model...

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 13 Jun 2016 12:17 #77772

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WWDC isn't a pro app update event, to I'd not hold my breath on anything FCPX or pro app specific being announced, never is at WWDC. It is for third party developers, not Apple developers (they have all this info already). But the OS X and hardware announcements could possibly give us insights into the future of FCPX.

I think it is safe to say we'll see some cool stuff in FCPX later this year.

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 13 Jun 2016 15:13 #77774

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About 2 more hours, and we will see what we see...
Why is this morning going so sssslllloooowwww....?

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 13 Jun 2016 15:14 #77775

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Stop moaning, it has been a very very very slow cold wet DAY..13 hours of being awake...

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 13 Jun 2016 15:17 #77776

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If we see anything today at all, it will be a reveal that Final Cut Pro is now available for the iPad Pro with some sort of workflow with the desktop version. Otherwise, we will just see an update in the App Store without any fanfare.

Invalid consumer key/secret in configuration

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 13 Jun 2016 16:23 #77777

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The only thing we've every really seen are new services or OS X functions that help general workflow. Or a shot of FCPX in a screen shot about some new function or AVFoundation technology. I just watched the videos from last year on making audio extensions, and editing video with AVFoundation mutable composites and movies. Techie stuff, but fun. And new hardware announcements, if any, are always fun. Let's us see how much more efficient it will be to edit on the next gen MBP. Even if there's nothing remotely related to FCPX, they're still a lot of fun to watch.

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 13 Jun 2016 19:04 #77778

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Seems maybe nothing until Sierra comes out in the Fall... :dry:

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 13 Jun 2016 21:17 #77784

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Sierra isn't offering anything that would improve FCPX, except for Siri finding your lost Libraries. I don't see any links between Sierra and the pro apps functionality.

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 13 Jun 2016 23:12 #77788

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Well a new file system is being revealed in the Developer side, APFS will be a replacement for HFS+. This will have lots of implications for Pro Apps. Some of the features should improve speeds, storage and manage versions and cooperative editing. Changes to shared storage coming too.
It does include some features from ZFS.
Really thought Apple might implement ZFS, but guess that boat sailed years ago. Many aspects of HFS+ look to be deprecated soon.
RAID support changing once again. Still supported, but crippled.

Looks like Sierra will not require the new APFS. APFS won't launch until 2017, so 1 year?? to go with old file structure. APFS doesn't appear to be ready for prime time. Beta versions of Sierra running on HFS+.

macOS, Sierra(10.12) will be dropping support for computers from ~2009/2010 depending on model. Also iOS will be dropping iPhones and iPads.

New version of Xcode 8 is launching that will unify some code between platforms.

If anything for FCPX, would be hinted at in later workshops. May (or) not be announced/released.
I think Metal will be fully integrated into Motion and FCPX. This may tie into expanded 3D features. Just guessing and hoping.

Lots of new API/SDKs being added or updated for many frameworks.

We'll see how the week evolves.
Hope this helps, Greg

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Last edit: by VidGreg. Reason: spelling

Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 14 Jun 2016 03:11 #77792

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Metal is not a separate entity. I spoke with an Apple pro app rep during NAB about Metal. It is simply an API for third party programers to access deeper into OS X (macOS), as Apple's internal programmers have been doing for a long time. So Metal by itself wouldn't offer anything to pro apps they don't already have at this time. Again, Metal is not an engine, it is an API. Apple programers don't need the API, as they have had the tricks and tools to get to that stuff all along.

The "Apple File System" does have some tidbits that could help out down the road. But that is all speculation at this point. Aside from what is possible, there is what upper management dictates to the pro app teams to do. And that doesn't always match what we end users need.

macOS Sierra (OS X 10.12) will officially run on:
Late 2009 & later
MacBook
iMac

2010 & Later
MacBook Air
MacBook Pro
Mac mini
Mac Pro

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Last edit: by BenB.

Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 14 Jun 2016 05:44 #77798

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Ben
We have been through this before, Metal is a framework.
So says Apple.
Look to the Developer Site, read all about "Metal Framework".
It is in every Mac with El Capitan installed as "Metal Framework", look in your System >Library>Frameworks>Metal Framework. Same as all the other frameworks.
Yes, there is API (Application Programming Interface) for MetalKit frameworks to call many routines, calls and a whole lot of resources, but it all relates to Metal framework. Yes you have to use API to reference Metal. AFAIK this is true of all "frameworks"?? It is the "Interface". Apple has to provide the MTL coding. There is a MetalKit, there is language, procedures, calls that all have to be adhered to in order to take advantage of Metal speed. If you don't write the specific MTL code calls, at best the app will fall back on Open CL/GL and no speed boost. Apps have to include Metal code to use Metal.
Not sure what you do or don't understand about programming, frameworks, APIs, Open CL/GL.
Metal replaces a lot of higher level universal code that contains a lot of legacy junk and Metal allows certain routines to run much faster at low level, like shaders, textures, and computational mathematics being sent to the GPUs. It is Apple's equivalent to Vulcan and Direct X. GPUs also have to able to utilize Metal. Apple has in essence stopped supporting newer versions of Open GL in favor of Metal.
So Apple is making a very big deal out of Metal to programmers to write it into their code. There is a lot of new Metal API resources being released relating to speeding up code and lowering CPU demands this year, right now at WWDC. And yes Apple coders do use the Metal framework. I expect to see the next iterations of Motion and to a lesser degree FCPX to utilize Metal.
Yes 3rd party programs use Metal APIs to create apps to take advantage of this low level programming.
I'm not going to continue to argue with you about whether Metal is a "Framework" or not, Apple says it is, I believe them. Not just someone you talked to at NAB.

As to APFS as replacement of HFS+, lots of folks have been hoping to see Apple replace 30yr old file structure.
I remember ZFS. Apple for several years fully supported it. There is still a Mac version being community supported. It also got caught up in the switch from PPC to Intel.

The problem with ZFS when I was playing with it was how slow drives were, especially write speeds. You needed to use expensive RAM to get any real speed with it. Now drives are faster, there is flash drives, RAM is cheap and you can create very robust systems. ZFS IMHO is now a viable alternative to HFS+.

I actually suspect that LumaForge may be using ZFS and Open NAS to build its new share solutions. Just guessing. If I am right, then you can see the benefits we end users might gain. Yep, just speculation.

If the new APFS takes the best of ZFS then it might be very useful indeed. I have only been reading a few reviews of it, and it is still very much in development. Wasn't talked about in keynote, most likely because it is not ready to replace HFS+. We will have to see. Just the geek in me likes this type of discussion.
Will it provide better, faster and more robust systems. Early to say, but I like what I'm reading.

One problem I can see is how compatible will it be with any other OS?? Will Apple Open Source it?? ZFS is now Open Sourced.

Looking forward to seeing how much is talked about in WWDC workshops.
OK, I'm done, don't plan on flaming on this topic. Just stating my opinion. Yours differs, OK.
Let's just see where all this goes this week.

Peace, Greg

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 14 Jun 2016 06:18 #77799

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// full quote //

@ Greg
thanks for that, interesting read, even me, the non-engineer can follow ... :lol:

My first impression after the keynote (aside never saw so much stagetime for women!):

the next evolutions of OSs are about 'integration' ...
copy/paste cross devices/platforms? imagine assistant 'throws' some pics into your project
'big/smart data' ... imagine an auto-filter based upon on your most-searched for
or that 'use your iPad as a Wacom' demo ....

... there's lots and new going on under the hood, but I'd not be surprised upon new user-experiences ....

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 14 Jun 2016 12:34 #77823

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Sorry Greg, I have to firmly take the stand you don't understand what Metal really is. An API can be a Framework. Framework doesn't equal Engine. And I've spoken with several developers at Apple. I'll take their word over yours. We must agree to disagree. Having been a UNIX engineer since way back when, I know full well what a Framework it. It is not an engine, and this one is simply functioning as an API. So, we disagree. Done.

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 15 Jun 2016 22:34 #77886

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Before anyone asks, yes, I've got the Developer Pre-Release version of Sierra installed on a test Mac. Yes, pro apps run fine on it. Yes, finding libraries made in the past month via Siri is awesome. No, nothing new happening in the pro apps, in fact I find them slightly sluggish. And NO third party add-ons are working yet. Even 3rd party AU units won't validate. And it updates your Photos library, so you can't take it back to El Capitan. So, that will sit in the corner gathering dust until a few more beta updates are released. But it is a sweet OS to work with!

Carry on...

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 16 Jun 2016 03:29 #77892

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BenB wrote: … full quote...



thank, Ben, for sharing and sacrificing your test Mac ... ;)

the part "… no third party add-on…" makes me bit shivering, but I guess there's enough time for the vendors to update their tools ...

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Waiting on 10.2.4 and 10.3 16 Jun 2016 10:39 #77899

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Why is it when Metal comes up there's always so much confusion? Ben and Greg are saying the same thing. Metals just a framework to do 3D graphics rendering and computations on the GPU, just like OpenGl and OpenCL currently do, but with less overhead on the CPU.

Apple might have been using it in some form for a while now before public release, maybe on Motion and FCPX, maybe not. Certainly the initial release of FCPX used OpenCL for compute....it was in the marketing.

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