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TOPIC: Noise Reduction Problem ?!?

Noise Reduction Problem ?!? 10 Dec 2018 19:25 #98105

  • Axel
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Didn't try the new NR effect in earnest, when 10.4.4 came out. Now I've just finished editing a private travel video, just five minutes, three shots needed some NR. Was pleased to find that playback (with the effect applied) remained smooth, and the effect was only rendered on the frame the playhead was paused on. Also liked the quality, didn't bother to compare it to Neat (which I also have). Good enough, at least for my purpose, I only have a few noisy shadows after lifting the mids in slightly underexposed clips, not too distracting at all without NR.

BUT: after exporting the project, the said clips stuttered!

I vaguely remembered an old rule about Neat. Someone somewhere had stated that it should always be the first effect - which never made a lot of sense to me and an advice I never followed myself. Never ran into trouble. However, just to make sure I dragged the effect on top of the CC instances and exported the ranges - same stuttering.

Maxed out iMac 2015, Mac OS 10.14.1, FCP 10.4.4, 2160 XAVC @ 23,98, Original Media, exported to ProRes422 as Master. Anybody noticed this?
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Noise Reduction Problem ?!? 10 Dec 2018 20:32 #98107

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I read somewhere, user manual or something, that Apple states Noise Reduction needs to be the first effect applied to a clip.

And watch the sharpening in that new effect, it's not good. Noise reduction is good, but I find the sharpening function really badly implemented. The Sharpen effect does a much better job. This new one stair steps really badly.
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Noise Reduction Problem ?!? 10 Dec 2018 21:24 #98109

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FCPX.guru wrote:
I read somewhere, user manual or something, that Apple states Noise Reduction needs to be the first effect applied to a clip.

Made a new project, put only one clip in it, applied only NR to it, exported it: same problem. Is it just me?
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Noise Reduction Problem ?!? 10 Dec 2018 21:59 #98110

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Found it. Retiming doesn't work with NR. The clips were 30p in 24p, Automatic Speed. No problem at real time speed. This is disappointing. Try it.
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Noise Reduction Problem ?!? 11 Dec 2018 03:39 #98114

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Tested, applied NR to a clip, retime 50 percent, exported just fine.
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Noise Reduction Problem ?!? 19 Dec 2018 22:56 #98232

I have just had a need to apply some NR to a shoot I did recently. The 10.4.4 effect did an OK job, and there is no stuttering.
But... my old late 2013 MBP had to work long and hard to render the effect. Appears to do it one frame at a time, and each frame taking maybe a couple of seconds.
Up until now, I have been able to 'cope' doing a multicam edit (with a mix of 4k and 1080p), despite dropping frames occasionally, the performance has been 'bearable' using this now old machine (bravo, that it has performed well for so long). But not with this effect.
Me thinks very very strongly that it's time to upgrade. Question is, to whose who have a recent MBP, what is the rendering performance like applying this NR effect.
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Noise Reduction Problem ?!? 25 Dec 2018 17:32 #98304

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Late 2013 Macbook pro retina here. NR takes a lot of time , much more than Neat Video. The other problem I'm facing is that it crashes fcpx while rendering. I also don't like the sharpening effect. I'm now using Lucas effect sharpening plugin and it's really nice, specially for me coming from photography.
Pablo Betancourt
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Noise Reduction Problem ?!? 25 Dec 2018 21:54 #98306

  • ronny courtens
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As with any noise reduction filter, the results you get depend on many different factors. Generally, I find the NR filter in FCP X quite good. The main advantage over things like Neat is that it runs in realtime and it does not bog your system down, even on lower-specced hardware.

I did a test with a 20" iPhone 7 clip slowed down to 50% with Optical Flow, to which I applied the NR filter with medium reduction and medium sharpening. The sharpening actually wasn't necessary because I find that the FCP X NR filter does not blur the footage as much as many other noise reduction filters. But I applied the sharpening anyway, just for the test.

On a regular MBP 2014, the unrendered 20" clip exported in 45 seconds which I find quite fast for noise reduction. And it plays perfectly smooth in QT player. So I think there may be other factors involved than just the NR filer if you experience very long render times, if your computer crashes while rendering, or if the processed clip does not play smoothly.

- Ronny
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Noise Reduction Problem ?!? 26 Dec 2018 15:43 #98309

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Hey Ronny, I've also found fcpx NR very nice and with an organic feel, something that is difficult to accomplish with Neat video. An of course that checking the effect in real time is a big plus also.
But in my case is crashing the rendering and the exported video plays choppy exactly on that clips with NR applied.
I've used Neat video instead, with no problem while rendering or playing smoothly the exported file.
But as you mentioned, many factors could be affecting the performance. I'm using Magic Bullet Mojo II, Luca Visual FX Image Sharpener and color finale on almost all of my clips. Magic Bullet is very slow to render but it never crashes fcpx.
Maybe is something related with NR and the graphic driver (Nvidida GeForce 750M) on Mac Os Mojave. Nvidia panel alerts me that is out of date on every restart, but there is no newer driver available or web drive alternative.
Pablo Betancourt
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Noise Reduction Problem ?!? 26 Dec 2018 16:02 #98310

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Hey Pablo!

I agree that the graphics card is the culprit here, especially if you have an external monitor connected to your MBP. The NR filter uses Metal2, and the 750 M works very badly with Metal. There have been quite some reports about this, and it looks like there won't be a solution from Nvidia any day soon. There are workarounds, but they seem quite convoluted to me. Here's some extra information:

discussions.apple.com/thread/8596539
forums.macrumors.com/threads/any-news-ab...-yet.2088300/page-12

- Ronny
Last Edit: 26 Dec 2018 16:03 by ronny courtens.
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Noise Reduction Problem ?!? 26 Dec 2018 22:57 #98313

  • Betancourt
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Mmmmhh, Maybe I should buy a good external graphic card. I cannot afford a new macbook right now and some coleagues told me that they overheat very easily after 15' of intensive tasks and the performance is affected. Can I avoid the nvidia 750M and just use an externall one or the system uses both?

Thanks!
Pablo Betancourt
Last Edit: 26 Dec 2018 22:58 by Betancourt.
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Noise Reduction Problem ?!? 27 Dec 2018 18:02 #98322

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I've jus talked with apple support. They recommended me downgrading to High Sierra because the admit that my graphic card is not compatible with mojave.

Fortunately it seems there is an official path to downgrade:

itunes.apple.com/es/app/macos-high-sierr...246284741?ls=1&mt=12
Pablo Betancourt
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